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Group: Group Guidelines
Where does the shoe pinch?
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In the first phase of our joint work, let's collect the problems without debating them or proposing possible solutions. There will be time for that later (see: Procedure Proposal).
The question is:
"What problems do you have as administrators or members with regard to groups?"
(Put it in your own words, preferably in the first person.)
Example: "I am not very enthusiastic when the administration of a group that I have not applied for falls to me. I am not motivated to be forced to take care of something. I find the officially offered solution that I could leave the group immediately in such a case and join again unsatisfactory. Likewise, I'm just passing the buck and possibly frustrating someone else."
You are invited to unload everything here without anything being censored or scrutinized.
The emoij symbolizes that a stated topic has been taken up and is listed here:
The phrasing in this list is not a literal quotation. Sometimes the information has been reworded or shortened to make it easier to understand.)
1. The current arrangement of automatically replacing a departing administrator with the group member with the longest group membership is annoying and demotivating. (Bergfex)
2. The use of another member's image normally requires the creator's consent. (Steve Paxton) If the creator is unreachable, does the same rule apply as for homepage images? There we find: "<The use of this edited picture for the purpose of presenting and promoting our association is in accordance with the Terms of Use, Article 5.10"
3. There are frequently members who are bothered by the maximum number of posts per time unit set by the administrators. Generally guiding standards that are objectively justified would be useful here. Administrators could follow them and would only have to justify justified exceptions. (HeidiHo)
4. It is not in keeping with the times to exclude images produced with AI support from general groups. (Luis Miguel)
5. It is perceived as unpleasant when rules are unexpectedly changed by 'ordre di mufti' without discussion with the group members. (Luis Miguel)
6. Most of the groups at ipernity are abandoned. They are nothing else but shared folders to dump as many images as people like to. Not much different than to view through some search results or keywords. (Sami Serola)
7. If the number of uploads is not limited, group anarchy can take place, with saboteurs bombarding the groups with an extremely high number of posts. (Sami Serola)
8. People have used to ignore group rules and discussions unless they are forced to realize that something is going on. (Sami Serola)
9. At least when we hopefully get enough money to reprogram ipernity, we then should reconsider the whole group thing. It is most certainly not easy to please everyone. Or let's acknowledge it, it is impossible to please everyone. But we can at least try to. (Sami Serola)
10. We just want to have fun here. Sometimes too much is simply talked up in discussions - that's a shame. (Percy Schramm)
11. It's very unpleasant to be banned from a group without being warned in advance and being heard about the reasons. (Damir)
12. Groups are often poorly described. The lack of comprehensibility reduces the motivation to read or pay attention to the description. (Ingo Krehl)
13. It is often difficult to find an admin successor. In this respect, it is understandable if most people choose the easier way of quiet quitting. (Steve Paxton)
14. Disputatious members can make it very difficult for admins to fulfil their duties. This kind of trouble is simply too much for some volunteers. (Herb Riddle)
15. Fun groups often taken too seriously. (uwschu)
16. Deleting a post without prior notification can be perceived as a punishment. (uwschu)
17. The excluding of images that are not photos (DigiArt, painting, graphics, etc.) from a group that aims to communicate club-wide could be a violation of the principle of equal treatment of club members (Bergfex)
18. It would be a pitty to exclude artworks, etc. from HFF, one of the most popular groups of ipernity. (Gillian Everett)
19. There does not seem to be a standardised procedure for setting limits in public groups. (Be◉bachter)
20. We should avoid creating duplicates for each group that deals with a specific photo content. This would lead to an extreme fragmentation of the group landscape with many groups in which there is hardly anything going on. (Guido Werner, RCW.)
21. No members should be excluded from fun groups (such as HFF). (Guido Werner)
22. There are groups that have a subject-related title but are actually about club-wide communication and social interaction. Nobody should be excluded from this. (Boarischa Krautmo)
23. The translations of the French title "Charte des groupes" into other languages ( "Richtlinien, Guidelines, Directivas, Direttive, Richtlijnen, Guia) are misleading. They should be corrected. (Bergfex)
24. There are numerous groups where the admins do not monitor compliance with the rules. (Bergfex, *ઇઉ*)
25. Descriptions and rules that must be accepted before joining are often only formally accepted in practice. (*ઇઉ*)
26. There is a lack of clear communication channels for administrators and moderators to avoid misunderstandings. (*ઇઉ*)
27. Administrators who have created groups appear to have a higher rank - and therefore different rights - than administrators who have been tasked by the IMA team with managing orphaned groups. (*ઇઉ*)
28. The group guidelines have so far been formulated in the imperative. A form of language that we are used to from public authorities. This contributes to the perception of a gap between those who "determine" something (ima team ?) and those who have to observe something. That's not so good. (Bergfex)
29. It is annoying if the group title is preceded by any special characters. This makes the alphabetical search more difficult. (aNNa schramm, Ulrich John, José Manuel Polo, Bergfex)
30. If someone wants to set up a new group, they should only be allowed to do so if there is no existing group for the topic. (José Manuel Polo)
31. The current chaos in the groups should be eliminated and they should be organised according to uniform and efficient criteria that have been agreed beforehand. (José Manuel Polo)
32. Anyone who takes over a well-functioning but orphaned group should not be allowed to arbitrarily change the rules. (Max Biobauer)
33. There is no "guideline" on when to open a public group as "generally accessible" or when to choose the "by invitation only" option. (Bergfex)
34. The Group Busters initiative launched two years ago has not been well received. Perhaps the processes are too bureaucratic. (Bergfex)
35. A lightbox view of the group posts is missing. (MJ Maccardini)
36. Neglected groups are an old basic evil of ipernity. (Eberhard Fritsche, *ઇઉ*)
37. Setting the following option in the group settings: "Yes, I want to systematically review all the contributions" leads to huge backlogs when the admin is not diligent. (Bergfex, Malik Raoulda)
38. Description of the group rules in only one language, not in all 7 provided ones. (Bergfex)
39. Very large groups on global topics can also be unattractive to visitors and cast a bad light on our community. (Bergfex)
40. A multi-year search for an admin ("admin wanted") is embarrassing for our community. (Bergfex)
41. More than a dozen "best of" groups are also embarrassing for our community. (*ઇઉ*)
....
....
(in progress)
The question is:
"What problems do you have as administrators or members with regard to groups?"
(Put it in your own words, preferably in the first person.)
Example: "I am not very enthusiastic when the administration of a group that I have not applied for falls to me. I am not motivated to be forced to take care of something. I find the officially offered solution that I could leave the group immediately in such a case and join again unsatisfactory. Likewise, I'm just passing the buck and possibly frustrating someone else."
You are invited to unload everything here without anything being censored or scrutinized.
The emoij
symbolizes that a stated topic has been taken up and is listed here:1. The current arrangement of automatically replacing a departing administrator with the group member with the longest group membership is annoying and demotivating. (Bergfex)
2. The use of another member's image normally requires the creator's consent. (Steve Paxton) If the creator is unreachable, does the same rule apply as for homepage images? There we find: "<The use of this edited picture for the purpose of presenting and promoting our association is in accordance with the Terms of Use, Article 5.10"
3. There are frequently members who are bothered by the maximum number of posts per time unit set by the administrators. Generally guiding standards that are objectively justified would be useful here. Administrators could follow them and would only have to justify justified exceptions. (HeidiHo)
4. It is not in keeping with the times to exclude images produced with AI support from general groups. (Luis Miguel)
5. It is perceived as unpleasant when rules are unexpectedly changed by 'ordre di mufti' without discussion with the group members. (Luis Miguel)
6. Most of the groups at ipernity are abandoned. They are nothing else but shared folders to dump as many images as people like to. Not much different than to view through some search results or keywords. (Sami Serola)
7. If the number of uploads is not limited, group anarchy can take place, with saboteurs bombarding the groups with an extremely high number of posts. (Sami Serola)
8. People have used to ignore group rules and discussions unless they are forced to realize that something is going on. (Sami Serola)
9. At least when we hopefully get enough money to reprogram ipernity, we then should reconsider the whole group thing. It is most certainly not easy to please everyone. Or let's acknowledge it, it is impossible to please everyone. But we can at least try to. (Sami Serola)
10. We just want to have fun here. Sometimes too much is simply talked up in discussions - that's a shame. (Percy Schramm)
11. It's very unpleasant to be banned from a group without being warned in advance and being heard about the reasons. (Damir)
12. Groups are often poorly described. The lack of comprehensibility reduces the motivation to read or pay attention to the description. (Ingo Krehl)
13. It is often difficult to find an admin successor. In this respect, it is understandable if most people choose the easier way of quiet quitting. (Steve Paxton)
14. Disputatious members can make it very difficult for admins to fulfil their duties. This kind of trouble is simply too much for some volunteers. (Herb Riddle)
15. Fun groups often taken too seriously. (uwschu)
16. Deleting a post without prior notification can be perceived as a punishment. (uwschu)
17. The excluding of images that are not photos (DigiArt, painting, graphics, etc.) from a group that aims to communicate club-wide could be a violation of the principle of equal treatment of club members (Bergfex)
18. It would be a pitty to exclude artworks, etc. from HFF, one of the most popular groups of ipernity. (Gillian Everett)
19. There does not seem to be a standardised procedure for setting limits in public groups. (Be◉bachter)
20. We should avoid creating duplicates for each group that deals with a specific photo content. This would lead to an extreme fragmentation of the group landscape with many groups in which there is hardly anything going on. (Guido Werner, RCW.)
21. No members should be excluded from fun groups (such as HFF). (Guido Werner)
22. There are groups that have a subject-related title but are actually about club-wide communication and social interaction. Nobody should be excluded from this. (Boarischa Krautmo)
23. The translations of the French title "Charte des groupes" into other languages ( "Richtlinien, Guidelines, Directivas, Direttive, Richtlijnen, Guia) are misleading. They should be corrected. (Bergfex)
24. There are numerous groups where the admins do not monitor compliance with the rules. (Bergfex, *ઇઉ*)
25. Descriptions and rules that must be accepted before joining are often only formally accepted in practice. (*ઇઉ*)
26. There is a lack of clear communication channels for administrators and moderators to avoid misunderstandings. (*ઇઉ*)
27. Administrators who have created groups appear to have a higher rank - and therefore different rights - than administrators who have been tasked by the IMA team with managing orphaned groups. (*ઇઉ*)
28. The group guidelines have so far been formulated in the imperative. A form of language that we are used to from public authorities. This contributes to the perception of a gap between those who "determine" something (ima team ?) and those who have to observe something. That's not so good. (Bergfex)
29. It is annoying if the group title is preceded by any special characters. This makes the alphabetical search more difficult. (aNNa schramm, Ulrich John, José Manuel Polo, Bergfex)
30. If someone wants to set up a new group, they should only be allowed to do so if there is no existing group for the topic. (José Manuel Polo)
31. The current chaos in the groups should be eliminated and they should be organised according to uniform and efficient criteria that have been agreed beforehand. (José Manuel Polo)
32. Anyone who takes over a well-functioning but orphaned group should not be allowed to arbitrarily change the rules. (Max Biobauer)
33. There is no "guideline" on when to open a public group as "generally accessible" or when to choose the "by invitation only" option. (Bergfex)
34. The Group Busters initiative launched two years ago has not been well received. Perhaps the processes are too bureaucratic. (Bergfex)
35. A lightbox view of the group posts is missing. (MJ Maccardini)
36. Neglected groups are an old basic evil of ipernity. (Eberhard Fritsche, *ઇઉ*)
37. Setting the following option in the group settings: "Yes, I want to systematically review all the contributions" leads to huge backlogs when the admin is not diligent. (Bergfex, Malik Raoulda)
38. Description of the group rules in only one language, not in all 7 provided ones. (Bergfex)
39. Very large groups on global topics can also be unattractive to visitors and cast a bad light on our community. (Bergfex)
40. A multi-year search for an admin ("admin wanted") is embarrassing for our community. (Bergfex)
41. More than a dozen "best of" groups are also embarrassing for our community. (*ઇઉ*)
....
....
The topic of this discussion has been edited by Bergfex 5 months ago.
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Bergfex clubWenn nun Jens beispielsweise 3 Fotos hochlädt, so erlauben das die bisherigen Regeln. Und - Jens hat auch schon früher öfter 3 Fotos hochgeladen - keinen hat es gestört, warum also jetzt dieses Theater ? Wir wollen doch einfach hier nur unseren Spaß haben. Manchmal wird auch durch Diskussionen einfach zuviel zerredet - schade ..." (Percy Schramm)
Bergfex clubWas mich grundsätzlich stört:
Irgendjemand hatte/hat eine Idee, zu einem beliebigen Thema eine Gruppe zu gründen.
Er/sie macht sich Gedanken, was für eine Art Beiträge dort willkommen sind, damit die Gruppe insgesamt eine "runde Sache" wird, die sich auch Außenstehende, die nichts mit der Gruppe zu tun haben, ganz gern mal anschauen/durchscrollen.
Damit auch wirklich geeignete Beiträge in die jeweilige Gruppe finden, stellt der/die Admin entsprechende Regeln auf - die dann auch eindeutig in der Gruppenbeschreibung nachzulesen sind.
Wird nun irgendjemand Mitglied der Gruppe, gehe ich davon aus, er/sie hat sich diese Gruppenregeln durchgelesen - und akzeptiert sie. Soweit gehe ich mal von konkludentem Verhalten aus. Stellt irgendjemand irgendwann (evtl. viel später) fest, dass diese Gruppenidee irgendwie doch nicht zu seinen/ihren eigenen Vorstellungen passt, dann bleibt ihm/ihr belassen, diese "unpassende Gruppe" wieder zu verlassen.
Die Admins der HFF-Gruppe geben sich seit Jahren große Mühe, die Gruppe ordentlich zu verwalten. WIE sie das im Einzelnen machen, ist imo deren Sache - dazu sind sie schließlich die Admins, die freiwillig jede Menge Arbeit auf sich nehmen, die Sache am Laufen zu halten.
"Einfache" Mitglieder der Gruppe, die selber KEINERLEI Aufwand treiben, die Gruppe am Laufen zu halten, sollten natürlich von anstehenden Änderungen des Reglements informiert werden.
Auf der Diskussionsseite einer jeden Gruppe kann Jede/r seine/ihre Meinung zu evtl. geplanten Änderungen frei äußern. Es wird vermutlich keine/n Admin geben, der/die sich sinnvollen Überlegungen verweigert.
Letztlich entscheiden müssen aber die Admins. Wem die ganze Richtung nicht passt, dem steht frei, der dann "ungeliebten" Gruppe den Rücken zu kehren. Man kann ja eine eigene, neue Gruppe gründen ... spätestens dann (nämlich, wenn man sich plötzlich selbst in der Verantwortung sieht) wird der Eine oder die Andere erkennen: sooo einfach ist das gar nicht. Allen Recht getan, ist eine Kunst die niemand kann.
Bergfex club has replied to Heidiho clubdiese Arbeitsgruppe nichts mit HFF zu tun. Dort kristallisierte sich lediglich heraus, dass Admins offenbar keine ausreichend gute Grundlage haben, auf die sie sich berufen können, wenn sie angefeindet werden.
Die von Dir angetippten allgemeinen Themen beantworte ich allgemeinen Teil dieser Arbeitsgruppe: www.ipernity.com/group/2632968/discuss/198776/comment/67214758#comment67214758
Bergfex clubbtw: It's not about fences. It's about communication. Everything's about communication. Is there any meaning in wishing a happy fence? Nope.
But there is a meaning in social interaction. There is a formalized way to wish others a great weekend. That's the point: Interaction, seeing the counterpart (even virtually). Global village is still a village: Good evening, Mrs. X, wish you a happy weekend!, Oh, thank you, Mr Y, that's so kind of you, wish you a good weekend, too. Pictures? Forget about it." (Boarischa Krautmo)
Bergfex clubI personally consider the translations of the French title "Charte des groupes" into other languages to be misleading.
The term "charter" is used for voluntary commitments by non-governmental organisations. An ipernity group could be understood as such.
However, the translation into "Richtlinien, Guidelines, Directivas, Direttive, Richtlijnen, Guia) changes the character to the effect that it refers to regulations issued by institutions. This was correct in the relationship between Ipernity S.A. and its customers.
But in our case, the rules that we agree together are more of a voluntary commitment, i.e. a charter. The translations should be corrected.
Bergfex clubJust reflections on, or things seen through the water are allowed !!! NO people, NO plants, NO boats, NO animals"
Inzwischen wurde die Gruppe "vererbt". Über die Veränderung kann sich jede/r selbst ein Bild machen.
* ઇଓ * club has replied to Bergfex clubThe same phenomenon occurs in many other groups, including so-called best-of groups that are not moderated.
Many groups have specific descriptions and rules that must be accepted before joining. Unfortunately, in practice, these rules are often only formally accepted.
What I miss here is the establishment of clear communication channels for administrators and moderators. This would help to avoid escalations as far as possible.
In addition, experience has shown that there appear to be differences in rank between administrators of public groups, and therefore different rights and responsibilities, which are not defined in the group guidelines.
For example, administrators who have created the groups they manage seem to have a higher rank - and therefore different rights - than administrators like myself who have been assigned to manage orphaned groups by the IMA team.
In practice, this means, for example, that as an administrator of groups assigned to me, I am not allowed to make “unauthorized” changes to the post count limit according to an ipernity member — not according to the ima team.
Bergfex club has replied to * ઇଓ * clubDie Gruppenrichtlinien sind bisher im Imperativ formuliert. Einer Sprachform also, wie man sie von Behörden gewohnt ist. Dies trägt dazu bei, dass ein Gefälle wahrgenommen wird zwischen denen, die etwas "bestimmen" (ima-Team ?) und denen, die etwas beachten müssen. Das ist nicht so gut. (Asche auf mein Haupt! Ich hab seinerzeit als Mitglied des ima-Teams selbst daran mitgewirkt. Sorry.)
Wie Guido Werner an anderer Stelle (meiner Ansicht nach zutreffend) anmerkte, kommt es in einem Verein aber weniger auf Gesetze und Vorschriften an, sondern darauf, was wir gemeinsam wollen. Wir sollten die bisherige "Richtlinien" nicht nur im Titel umbenennen ('Charta' oder 'Kodex'), sondern auch durchgehend in der Wir-Form formulieren. (Wir tun das so, weil wir uns darauf geeinigt haben.)
Ein wie auch immer gearteter Vorschlag sollte deshalb auch schlussendlich von der Mitgliederversammlung legitimiert werden.
-----
Zitat Guido: "... Wir kommen hier mit Gesetzesparagraphen m.E. nicht weiter. Eine völlig andere Frage ist aber, was wir eigentlich wollen oder nicht. Das gibt uns kein Gesetz vor, sondern müssen wir irgendwie anders bestimmen. Dabei sollten wir einen möglichst breiten Konsens finden. Bei einem kontroversen Thema etwas mit 60% zu 40% zu beschließen, könnte im schlimmsten Fall dazu führen, dass 40% der Mitglieder ipernity verlassen. Dann wäre ipernity tot, weil wir nicht mehr die kritische Größe hätten, um die Kosten dieser Webseite zu finanzieren. ..."
* ઇଓ * club has replied to Bergfex clubIn my opinion, ipernity rightly makes no distinction anywhere between the rights and responsibilities of an administrator who has created public groups himself or herself and those of an administrator who has been entrusted in one way or another with the administration of an orphaned or abandoned public group.
(Not only) Therefore, I find it discriminatory and encroaching when community members try to dictate to me what I may or may not do based on their personal opinions.
It is safe to assume that I am not the only person who is affected by such attacks.
In order to protect all equally or similarly affected administrators of public groups from such attacks by other members of the community, which usually take place in secret, I think it would be reasonable and desirable to include a legally and factually justified reference to the equality and equal rights of administrators of self-founded groups and those who have taken over orphaned or abandoned groups in the future group guidelines, since there is obviously a gap in the current group guidelines.
Of course, this proposal, like all other proposed changes from this group, should be submitted to the IMA team and ultimately to the General Assembly for legitimacy.
With all due respect, Guido and some others may prefer to leave laws out of the equation. But the fact remains that we are all subject to certain laws. If we ignore them, it can have potentially serious consequences not only for us, but for others as well.
Do we really want that?
Bergfex club2) También estoy de acuerdo con Anna y Ulrich en que el nombre del grupo debiera poderse ordenar por abecedario y que fuera en un solo idioma. El Esperanto no cuajó, pero sabemos cual es el más utilizado y entendible, yo lo aceptaría aunque no fuera el mío.
3) Me gustaría que todos tuvieran exigencias básicas comunes, a salvo de alguna particular.4) Obviamente, si alguien quiere grupo nuevo, que únicamente pudiera abrirlo si no existiera ya un grupo para el tema que se pretenda abordar.
4) Obviamente, si alguien quiere grupo nuevo, que únicamente pudiera abrirlo si no existiera ya un grupo para el tema que se pretenda abordar.
En definitiva; desmontar el actual caos en los grupos y organizarlos unificando criterios eficientes, previamente consensuados." (José Manuel Polo)
Bergfex clubMan könnte vielleicht mal hinterfragen, warum die dort eingerichteten Möglichkeiten so wenig genutzt werden. Sind die Abläufe zu bürokratisch? Ist die Möglichkeit zu wenig bekannt? Oder was sonst?
Rob Stamp club has replied to MJ Maccardini (trail… clubThis might be described as suitable for a 'Suggestion' ticket.
I have to assume that for your club meetings, you do use the Lightbox option for the latest contributions, that is available when viewing the group. In Assignment101 for December 14 I read of the rule relating to adding the keyword on only 5 photos, while more may be added. So I understand your desire for this feature.
Note that a search of photos, whether general or limited to keyword, also has no Lightbox option. It was not provided by the original programmers, perhaps for good reason, as I have yet to understand the operation of the Lightbox, as to how the list of photos in handled.
So either I find that I can add Lightbox to Search, or it remains on a wish list.
Bergfex clubEberhard Fritsche, Tote Pferde....
* ઇଓ * club has replied to Bergfex clubBergfex club3 Bad Habits:
* ઇଓ * club has replied to Bergfex clubIn topic groups and groups with specific rules, it makes sense to review posts to avoid the aforementioned chaos, as experience has shown that many members simply "forget" the topics or rules of groups.
Schöne Grüße,
Volker
Bergfex club has replied to Ruesterstaude clubIch bin schon dabei, die beiden Humor-Gruppen zusammenzufassen. Laura und Rob unterstützen das von der technischen Seite. Aber die Initiative für solche Aktionen sollte bei uns Mitgliedern liegen. Wir können Laura und Rob nicht alles aufbürden.
Malik Raoulda club has replied to Bergfex clubBergfex clubSome examples:
Animal Photos (17,705 contributions) Which visitor is going to look at all those posts, and why in this particular group when there are more than 50 other animal groups?
Amazing Nature (34,063 contributions) This group seems to be
Only your best photos!! (14,359 contributions)
Flowers (19,858 contributions) Group rule: "Flowers from all over the world. We only accept high quality photos with flowers as the main motif. Unfortunately, there are also many images that do not comply with the rules.
Wonderful flowers (10,044 contributions) This group seems to be
Amazing Details (10,770 contributions) The title (URL) is somewhat misleading. In addition, this group is also a duplicate of the following one:
Single Flower (2,407 contributions) This group seems to be
Birds (10,094 contributions). Group rule: Can't believe, that no one has found a "birds" group!
**International Photo Gallery** (20,565 contributions) The group is a duplicate of five other groups. The ima team has been looking for an admin for 2 years.
59 members, 2,163 posts, Admin (seems to be) inactive since Nov. 2014.
There are many groups with similar content.
I add a small list of best-of groups.
Many of the groups and contributions do not live up to the title "best-of" and do more harm than good to ipernity.
But everyone should form his or her own opinion, please.
"BEST-of" groups:
• IPERNITY.best PHOTO of the month, created 14 years ago,
23 members, 1,052 posts.
Unfortunately, Admin deceased, group orphaned.
Discussion there by Heidiho and tommes noteworthy.
• BEST OF THE WEEK, created 2 years ago,
10 members, 1,861 posts, content is not what one could expect from a best-of group
• " BEST of Bokeh ", created 7 years ago,
28 members, 2,348 posts, content is not what one could expect from a best-of group
• The Best of UK Landscapes and Seascapes, created 10 years ago,
3 members, 45 posts, Admin (seems to be) inactive, apparently inactive group.
• Best of macro, created 13 years ago,
24 members, 7,031 posts, Admin (seems to be) inactive since May 2020, many close-ups, content is not what one could expect from a best-of group
• Best of the Studio 1, created 14 years ago,
4 members, 6 posts, Admin (seems to be) inactive since 2019, apparently inactive group.
• Best of Bretagne, created 14 years ago,
12 members, 18 posts, Admin (seems to be) inactive since Apr. 2022, group apparently orphaned.
• [Ipernity] the really best of, created 14 years ago,
6 members, 5 posts, Admin (seems to be) inactive since Sept. 2022.
• " 100% BEST OF : Top pictures of cities and villages ", created 8 years ago,
90 members, 4,724 posts, many posts missing the point
• The Best Of HDR, created 15 years ago,
15 members, 96 posts, Admin (seems to be) inactive since Aug. 2017,
apparently only one active member.
• Best of ipernity, created 15 years ago,
173 members, 14,170 posts, content is not what one could expect from a best-of group
• " Meine eigenen " Meisterwerke " - Mes propres "chefs - d'oeuvres " My own " master pieces ", created 8 years ago,
59 members, 4,641 posts, admin apparently inactive since 2020, content is not what one could expect from a best-of group
• Master and Muse, created 10 years ago,
27 members, 6,523 posts, content is not what one could expect from a best-of group
• Mamiya Masters, created 10 years ago,
7 members, 80 posts, Admin (seems to be) inactive since 2017,
apparently only one active member.
• 120 Film Masters, created 10 years ago,
26 members, 3.116 posts, group apparently orphaned,
only two members still active.
• Rolleiflex Masters, created 10 years ago,
5 members, 21 posts, last from 2016, group inactive, content is not what one could expect from a best-of group
• Hasselblad Masters, created 10 years ago,
11 members, 168 posts, apparently only one active member.
Bergfex clubBergfex clubIt has now been almost 3 months since this discussion thread was opened. The most important problems will now have been identified. They will be clustered over the next few days. The thread will then be opened with a call for proposals for solutions.
Bergfex club has replied to ୱ Kiezkickerde ( ͡°… club(Siehe Hinweis unterhalb der durchgezogenen Linie im Hauptartikel oben.)
On the Explore/Gallery page, contributions from different groups on the same recurring theme have been posted regularly several times a week for some time. The proportion of these posts on the first pages is disproportionately high compared to photos with other content.
Regarding the effect on other members and groups - here, for example, on the group “❖ Ipernity Photo Gallery ❖” (then “Ipernity Frontpage & What's Hot!”) - Sami already considered a few years ago whether photos from groups that regularly fill the Explore/Gallery wouldn't lead to other members being disadvantaged. Back then, the groups were different from today. But the situation has clearly gotten worse.
Unfortunately, I couldn't find this thought from Sami again. However, I'd like to address it because the development mentioned above has not only positive effects.
It would be helpful if there were a guideline in the group guidelines describing how to deal with the influence of such groups on other groups.
• Yosemite NP
Two members, 48 posts, group apparently inactive
• NOT The Sunday Challenge
Admin inactive since 2018 (?), group apparently inactive since 2022
• un chalenge personnel // eine persönliche Herausforderung // the challenge
14 members, group apparently orphaned since 07 May 2021 (ADMIN WANTED)
Rob Stamp revisited the matter of an admin for this group three weeks ago (see his comment there). So far, none of the group members seem to be willing to take over the administration…
• Weekly Photo Challenge
Admin is the only contributing member, apparently inactive since 2021
• Theme of the Day: Photo Challenge
3 members, 6 posts, group apparently inactive
• The Sunday Challenge
Admin is the only member, apparently inactive
Bergfex club has replied to * ઇଓ * club* ઇଓ * club has replied to Bergfex clubraingirl club has replied to * ઇଓ * clubPlease feel free to note groups such as these to the team via a Help ticket. That way a list can be made and the groups dealt with as appropriate.
For this grouping, I've taken the time to check them out.
*Yosemite NP - This group may be "inactive", but just because a group hasn't had a contribution in awhile, that in and of itself doesn't mean the group should be deleted. In this case, the group is administered by an active club member. Could that administrator be proactive and try and find other photos that fit the group? Maybe. But not having recent additions doesn't invalidate a group such as this which has a clear focus and whose included photos meet that focus. I didn't take the time to see if there was another group with the same focus, but if there was one option could be to merge the groups together. That, however, doesn't seem like the highest priority around groups. If the photos included didn't match the focus of the group, then I would look more closely at what to do. As it is, the group will remain.
*NOT The Sunday Challenge - and
*The Sunday Challenge - These groups were run for over 10 years. They were active and well managed. I know the details around the closing of the groups, but I do know that the current administrator had troubles accessing their ipernity account for quite some time. The administrator has been on our website recently. They were a club member for many years.
(Note, there are many ways for a member to be active on ipernity, not just adding new photos. The team is able to see activity that may not be visible to someone just looking at the website.)
As to the groups themselves, because they have a clear focus and were well administered when active, they are of interest to look at even though closed to new additions. In order to make the groups obviously not active to an outsider, I have added the word CLOSED to the end of the groups' names. It might be better to use the word ARCHIVAL or something like that, but for now I simply chose CLOSED. [If someone wants to discuss this with the team, please write in an ipermail as replies to this message may get missed easily by me.]
*un chalenge personnel // eine persönliche Herausforderung // the challenge - This is a group that has had a chance for a new administrator to step forward, but none has. Also, while the group is an interesting concept, it doesn't hold up well as an archive because the images are so varied in topic (even though about 'health', too wide of a definition for an inactive group). Also the group name doesn't give a clear image of what the group is about. I believe that if GroupBusters had continued that this group would have been deleted for lack of a new administrator. For these reasons I have deleted the group.
*Weekly Photo Challenge - This group was run by one person. Whatever it may have been in the past, it currently was used basically as an album of the administrators photos - because the administrator hadn't done anything with the group in a long time, because the group name had nothing to do with the focus of the group, and because those photos were also in one of the administrator's albums, the group has been deleted.
*Theme of the Day: Photo Challenge - My best guess about this group is that someone else started the group and it was passed on to the current administrator when the other administrator left. It is obviously just a shell of a group. That said, the administrator is a long time club member who is active on the website. I have messaged them to let them know that the group will be deleted. Unless they respond saying why that shouldn't happen, the group will be deleted at the end of the month.
* ઇଓ * club has replied to raingirl clubI apologize, Laura. I accidentally replied to your comment under Bernhard's currently last comment.
So here is my answer from 22 hours ago, but now in the right place:
Very well done, Laura! Thank you for that — and not only for that.
Your arguments for and against closing or deleting a group are familiar and understandable to me.
More on that in the corresponding Club News.
Bergfex clubIndizien könnten sein:
- Die Gruppe bietet nicht alle 7 unterstützten Sprachen an.
- Die Gruppe hat kein Banner /Icon.
- Das Banner/Icon hat keinen Bezug zum Thema oder zu den Gruppenregeln.
- In den Gruppenregeln befinden sind 'korrupte' Links.
- Der/die Admin ist vom Club-Status in den Gaststatus zurückgefallen und im eigenen Account schon länger inaktiv.
- Die Beiträge der letzten Zeit weichen zunehmend vom Thema ab oder entsprechen nicht den Gruppenregeln
Bergfex club has added4 Jahreszeiten - Winter (3 korrupte Links + ein toter Contest in den Gruppenregeln. Der Admin ist seit mehr als 2 Jahren nicht mehr aktiv, nur noch "Gastmitglied". Es gibt themenfremde Beiträge)
Winterwonderland (Die Administratorin ist, bitte jetzt nicht lachen: Lea d'ipernity. Diese ist seit März 2015 nicht mehr aktiv. Von den 11 Gruppenmitgliedern sind 4 schon jahrelang nicht mehr aktiv. Solche Gruppen vermitteln ein desaströses Bild von ipernity.)
- - - - - - - - - -
Und jetzt noch eine Situation, zu der ich besser nicht schreibe, was ich dabei denke:
Es gibt sage und schreibe 22 Gruppen, deren Administrator Christophe Ruelle ist. (Ob er der damit verbundenen Verantwortung gerecht wird, bezweifle ich.)
* ઇଓ * club has replied to Bergfex clubMany neglected groups aren't even orphaned - and yet they still look deterrently chaotic …
Bergfex club has replied to * ઇଓ * clubAus unserem lokalen Fotoclub mit 35 Mitgliedern konnte ich niemanden bewegen, hier einen Account zu begründen. Das spricht Bände, oder?
ୱ Kiezkickerde ( ͡°… club has replied to Bergfex clubNun gut, und der Account von Lea - der wird dann wohl irgendwann gelöscht werden, ist ja kein Clubmitglied aktuell.
"Von den 11 Gruppenmitgliedern sind 4 schon jahrelang nicht mehr aktiv. Solche Gruppen vermitteln ein desaströses Bild von ipernity.)"
Ja. Aber nur, wenn man sie noch findet. Was spricht eigentlich dagegen, Gruppen in der Suche auszublenden, wenn sie bspw. länger nicht mehr aufgerufen wurden? Also niemand die Gruppenseite besucht hat? Sofern das technisch möglich ist...
Oder man integriert ein Häkchen, was gesetzt werden kann, dass eine Gruppe nicht mehr in Suchergebnissen auftaucht, ähnlich wie man das für seinen eigenen Account machen kann. Klar, das werden Leute, die ipernity verlassen haben, nicht vor ihrem verlassen tun - aber wenn sich dieses Häkchen bspw. ein Jahr nach dem letzten Aufruf der Gruppenseite durch jemanden automatisiert setzt, könnte man solche inaktiven Gruppen vielleicht zumindest schon einmal aus der Sichtbarkeit nehmen, ohne sie direkt zu löschen.
* ઇଓ * club has replied to Bergfex clubI've a different view of people like you and the other members of our board and extended board than your friends. People like you are not “stupid”, but courageous, and only responsibility in practice leads to lasting success.
Let's dare to hope that your example will set a precedent and that more members than before will finally find the courage to do the same. For many administrators, cleaning up their groups would be a good place to start.
Bergfex club has replied to ୱ Kiezkickerde ( ͡°… clubLea d'ipernity hat diesen Sonderstatus nicht. Ein Blick in ihren Account zeigt, dass sie seit April 2015 nichts mehr gepostet hat. Allerdings scheint sie noch auf andere Weise aktiv zu sein, sonst wäre ihr Gast-Account inzwischen gelöscht worden. (3-Jahrs-Frist)
Was die Gruppen angeht: Verwahrloste Gruppen begegnen einem auf Schritt und Tritt, wenn man über die Suchfunktion nach Themen sucht. Eine/n Besucher/in, der/die beispielsweise von der Fotocommunity her eine professionell gepflegte Gruppenstruktur kennt, wird so etwas kaum attraktiv finden.
Bergfex clubThe default images shown, which have nothing to do with the group title, are also more than disgraceful:
It should not be technically possible to continue with the creation of groups without having uploaded your own banner.
ୱ Kiezkickerde ( ͡°… club has replied to Bergfex clubUnd vor allem: man muss ja eine Gruppe erst anlegen können, um dann überhaupt für diese einen Banner und ein Icon hoch laden zu können.
Bergfex club has replied to ୱ Kiezkickerde ( ͡°… clubWenn Gruppen auch nach Monaten oder Jahren noch desolat sind, halte ich das für Schlamperei. (Ja, sorry. Manchmal darf ich auch Klartext reden.)
Bergfex clubPoorly recognisable or unsuitable icons make a neglected impression and create a poor image of our community as a whole.