Group: Ipernity Members Association Project
Good wills / Bonnes volontés
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This thread aims and only aims in allowing members who wish to put their skills into the project to come forward.
Cette rubrique a pour unique objectif de permettre aux membres qui souhaitent mettre leurs compétences au profit du projet et de l'association de se faire connaître.
The association is an open organization: our common interest is that every member with relevant skills should have the opportunity of contributing of making the project succeed.
L'association est une structure ouverte : notre intérêt à tous est de faire en sorte que toutes les compétences présentes en son sein aient l'opportunité de contribuer à l'aboutissement du projet.
We thank you not to use this thread if you do not follow this objective. If you don't respect its rules, the admins allow themselves to remove your contribution without notice in order to preserve the relevance of this thread
Merci de ne pas utiliser ce fil de discussion si vous ne suivez pas cet objectif. D'autres fils vous permettent de vous exprimer. Si vous ne respectez pas ces règles, les admins se réservent le droit de supprimer vos contributions sans préavis afin de préserver la pertinence de ce fil de discussion.
Cette rubrique a pour unique objectif de permettre aux membres qui souhaitent mettre leurs compétences au profit du projet et de l'association de se faire connaître.
The association is an open organization: our common interest is that every member with relevant skills should have the opportunity of contributing of making the project succeed.
L'association est une structure ouverte : notre intérêt à tous est de faire en sorte que toutes les compétences présentes en son sein aient l'opportunité de contribuer à l'aboutissement du projet.
We thank you not to use this thread if you do not follow this objective. If you don't respect its rules, the admins allow themselves to remove your contribution without notice in order to preserve the relevance of this thread
Merci de ne pas utiliser ce fil de discussion si vous ne suivez pas cet objectif. D'autres fils vous permettent de vous exprimer. Si vous ne respectez pas ces règles, les admins se réservent le droit de supprimer vos contributions sans préavis afin de préserver la pertinence de ce fil de discussion.
The topic of this discussion has been edited by Eric Desjours 5 years ago.
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My suggestion is if Ipernity do not extend the time frame for action on possible they are more than likely to fail. I have written to IP with a suggestion as written below
Ticket Number 437894
Hi Team
Survey
www.ipernity.com/blog/team/4648550?lc=1#comments
This survey in my opinion will not achieve intended result unless the below issues are addressed.
1
Ipernity need to send an email to all it's members to alert them on this new proposal and give them a chance to be informed. ( Not every members reads blogs)
The time frame allowed ( 5 days) is far to short for this important survey. I know there is merit in what I am saying and I would ask you to consider my views
It's a vital chance to save Ipernity Please don't miss it.
Above Ticket Reply
Hello Tess,
Thank you, we plan to send an email. But we must act step by step or we will be flagged again by email providers for spam.
We put an alert on the homepage for people to see the survey.
Best regards,
Audrey
If IP have failed to contact the majority of members by email even in small batches to prevent being flaged as Spam. ( as I have already said most people appear not to have read these blogs concerning the present situation and therefore are totally unaware of what's going on.) Emails are so much more important because most everyone reads their Emails
So in the end it is Vital to extend the time frame to allow the maximum input to achieve the Intended Goal.
Last chance to save Ipernity in my humble opinion.
My suggestion is if Ipernity do not extend the time frame for action on possible they are more than likely to fail. I have written to IP with a suggestion as written below
Ticket Number 437894
Hi Team
Survey
www.ipernity.com/blog/team/4648550?lc=1#comments
This survey in my opinion will not achieve intended result unless the below issues are addressed.
1
Ipernity need to send an email to all it's members to alert them on this new proposal and give them a chance to be informed. ( Not every members reads blogs)
The time frame allowed ( 5 days) is far to short for this important survey. I know there is merit in what I am saying and I would ask you to consider my views
It's a vital chance to save Ipernity Please don't miss it.
Above Ticket Reply
Hello Tess,
Thank you, we plan to send an email. But we must act step by step or we will be flagged again by email providers for spam.
We put an alert on the homepage for people to see the survey.
Best regards,
Audrey
If IP have failed to contact the majority of members by email even in small batches to prevent being flaged as Spam. ( as I have already said most people appear not to have read these blogs concerning the present situation and therefore are totally unaware of what's going on.) Emails are so much more important because most everyone reads their Emails
So in the end it is Vital to extend the time frame to allow the maximum input to achieve the Intended Goal.
In which case I'd have thought existing paid up Club members (active or otherwise) would be the most appropriate group to target in the first instance along with any free users that are currently active?
Also, what is happening about providing us with the results of the recent poll? William suggested a few days ago that the early signs were encouraging, but it would be useful to know when the full results are going to be published?
In which case I'd have thought existing paid up Club members (active or otherwise) would be the most appropriate group to target in the first instance along with any free users that are currently active?
Also, what is happening about providing us with the results of the recent poll? William suggested a few days ago that the early signs were encouraging, but it would be useful to know when the full results are going to be published?
William Sutherland clubAs Sara said, there is a lot going on in the background. We're at a critical stage. I expect info either Friday or Saturday (at the latest) re: Survey results.
Raffaele,
All members will be equal to one another when everything is in place. Right now the priority is to create the organization (IMA), which requires a lot of time and effort to meet the legal obligations of French law, address the survey results, which I can say are very positive and work on the next steps to save Ipernity. We have a very short window of time.
Thank you Mr. J Photography for your comment of understanding!
Treasa Ui Cionaodha has replied to William Sutherland clubThanks for the update on the time frame publication of the survey. As you can appreciate we really need the results to see if IP can survive or not .
It will be crucial that further information (in time to come) in the form of a balance sheet can also be given to all members before financial commitments are promised by the paying members.
That said, given all the complaints about poor communication on this matter from both the IMA and Team Ipernity, can you please confirm that what will be published will be a full and detailed analysis that everyone will be able to read and digest?
And by that I mean something similar to how I presented the User Poll Update when I'd finished compiling the results of the unofficial survey that I undertook last year.
Something that clearly describes and accounts for the answers given to each question, that provides figures in percentage of votes cast, and that allows the reader to understand not only the 'headline' figures, but what the difference was between Club and free account holders?
It would also be worth considering making the information available in document form, possibly Word, PDF and/or Excel as all of these can be posted on ipernity for download.
The Balance sheet must be provided by Ipernity SA's. As you said IMA does not exist at present.
The importance of the balance sheet is at the moment all we seem to know that Club membership raises €89,970.00. We do not know how much income is generated by sponsorship or investors or shareholders. I am assuming the 50k required is in addition to the income already being generated by the above. And we do not know how this equates with the cost of hosting the IP site.
So Balance Sheet information is essential.
William Sutherland club has replied to Treasa Ui CionaodhaHowever, this does mean that there will be a lot of people looking for a new home for their photos so perhaps an opportunity for those trying to save ipernity to exploit?
Here's the full announcement as posted on Facebook:
Thanks to Roger Dodger for initially drawing this to my attention! :)
William Sutherland clubEric Desjours clubWilliam Sutherland clubwww.ipernity.com/group/winclub
I started a new topic there, as an update on the situation. If IMA will indeed successfully save this place, then also Win a Club Membership group can continue. We of course have to go through number of details also there. For example we need to find out what are the contestants' options if they don't win the contest during the three month free trial period. Do they for example be able to start another three month trial period later on?
Stormlizard club has replied to Sami Serola (inactiv… clubJohn.
Bergfex club has replied to Sami Serola (inactiv… clubThat is of course if we win time to restart that competition.
Bergfex clubAn alternative might be, that IMA itself sponsors the memberships for the winners. You might say now: What's the benefit? IMA will get no paying members by that!
That's right in the beginning. But after one year of membership many of the winners will have established a portfolio, which they don't want to loose. We may assume, that they will prolongate their memberships by themselves. The goal will be reached a little bit later, but without stressing the budget of the existing members too much.
Stormlizard club has replied to Bergfex clubBergfex club@ Mecklenburg-Foto (Flickr):
Nein, Du hast nix übersehen. Aber 'Team-Ipernity' besteht nur noch aus dem Inhaber (Christophe Ruelle). Von ihm kommt nicht mehr viel. Leider.
Ich will deshalb mal - als Co-Founder innerhalb der IMA - versuchen, Deine Frage möglichst konkret zu beantworten (Auf deutsch! Wenn das Jemand qualifiziert ins Englische /Französische/Spanische übersetzen kann bzw. mag: sehr gerne! Der Google-Übersetzer sorgt nämlich manchmal mehr für Verwirrung als für Klarheit!):
Christophe ist einverstanden, die Plattform an IMA zu übergeben. (Das ist soweit bekannt.) Das von William Sutherland initiierte Crowdfunding hat die dafür erforderliche Hürde ($ 25.000) überschritten. (Auch das ist bekannt.)
IMA steht bereit, wartet aber noch auf wichtige Zahlen und Belegkopien, die Christophe zusammenstellen muss. Die brauchen wir, um verlässlich zu überprüfen, ob das Weiterbetreiben von IPERNITY überhaupt realistisch ist.
Üblicherweise stellen verkaufswillige Unternehmen alle Informationen für eine solche 'Due Diligence' vorab bereit. (Bei großen Firmen können das ganze Büroräume voller Akten sein, in denen sich potenzielle Käufer kundig machen dürfen.) Im vorliegenden Fall gibt es so was leider nicht. Wir als IMA mussten und müssen alles ziemlich mühselig erfragen, bzw. uns Kopien von Belegen schicken lassen. Das dauert leider länger, als uns lieb ist. Das Nadelöhr ist der jetzige Inhaber, nicht IMA! Andererseits ist Christophe aber durchaus kooperativ. Man erkennt das daran, dass er die Plattform weiterlaufen lässt, obwohl die Termine immer wieder hinausgeschoben werden müssen. (Letztlich kostet das sein Geld, nicht das der IMA.) Wir innerhalb der IMA können im Moment auch nichts Anderes tun, als zu warten. Und wir sind auch nicht glücklich mit dieser Hängepartie. Was uns trägt, ist unser unerschütterlicher Optimismus und der feste Wunsch, diese besondere Plattform am Leben zu erhalten!
Der nächste Fixpunkt ist eine geplante Skype-Konferenz zwischen William Sutherland und Christophe Ruelle am Montag/Dienstag (03./04. April). Wenn Christophe dabei alle angeforderten Daten mit Belegen liefert, kann es ganz schnell gehen. Denn obwohl wir sieben 'Founder' (alphabetisch: Bernhard Westrup (Österreich), Don Sutherland (USA), Eric Desjours (Frankreich), Lutz Petersen (Deutschland), Sami Serole (Finnland), Sara Shrives (Großbritannien) und William Sutherland (USA)) über den ganzen Globus hinweg in verschiedenen Zeitzonen leben, funktioniert unsere interne Kommunikation ziemlich flott.
Die alphabetische Reihenfolge habe ich übrigens gewählt, weil es keine Rangordnung gibt, bzw. gar nicht geben kann. Es hat ja noch keine Vollversammlung mit Wahlen stattgefunden! Möglicherweise stehen danach sogar ganz andere Namen für jene, die Verantwortung übernehmen (wollen). Derzeitig sind wir nur eine Peer-Group! Was danach kommt, entscheiden die Mitglieder der Vollversammlung - also all Jene, die der IMA verbindlich beitreten - d.h. nicht nur per Mausklick in der betreffenden IPERNITY-Gruppe, sondern ganz konkret über ihren Jahresbeitrag.
Details werden wir vorschlagen, sobald die Angelegenheit mit Christophe Ruelle in trockenen Tüchern ist. Vorher wäre es Ressourcenverschwendung. Denn einige von uns sind noch voll im Erwerbsleben! Wir machen das hier ohne Entgelt in unserer Freizeit! Wir haben keine Stäbe, die uns zuarbeiten. Wir haben auch keine PR-Abteilung, welche ein FAQ pflegen könnte und täglich irgendwelche aktuellen Nachrichtenposten kann. (Früher hab ich mal innerhalb eines Großkonzerns in einer solchen Abteilung gearbeitet. Mir ist voll bewusst, was ihr hier vermisst! Wir können euch deshalb nur um Geduld, Verständnis und Nachsicht bitten! Wir tun unser Bestes! Ich tippe das hier zum Beispiel gerade im Verzicht auf einen gemeinsamen Abend mit meiner Frau, die zum Glück großes Verständnis für mein diesbezügliches Engagement hat. Denn auch so was geht nicht in Minuten. Wenn ein Statement klar und knackig sein soll, braucht man umso mehr Zeit dafür.)
Falls die 'Due Diligence' ergeben sollte, dass ein Weiterbetreiben von IPERNITY wirtschaftlich unsinnig ist, wird die Plattform abgeschaltet und das Crowdfunding rückabgewickelt. Dann war's das. Leider! Es macht deshalb Sinn, unsere Inhalte - falls sie uns wichtig sind - mit HTTrack auf dem eigenen Rechner zu sichern. (Das klappt ganz gut, wenn man die richtigen Optionen einstellt. Man kann sich danach all seine Inhalte off-line ansehen und weiterverwenden, auch wenn die Ipernity-Server (in der Amazon-Cloud) irgendwann abgeschaltet sind.)
Falls die 'Due Diligence' jedoch ergibt, dass IPERNITY eine realistische Chance hat, wird als nächster Schritt die technische und wirtschaftliche Übetragung von IPERNITY S.A. auf IMA durchzuführen sein. Das beinhaltet einige legale Formalitäten, geht also nicht einfach per Unterschrift auf einem Bierdeckel. Weil aber beide beteiligten Parteien an einer schnellen und reibungslosen Übergabe interessiert sind, dürfte es (hoffentlich) nicht allzu viel Zeit in Anspruch nehmen.
Wir als Peer-Group der IMA sind jedenfalls unverändert der Ansicht - auch in Anbetracht aller bisher bereits vorliegenden Daten - dass IPERNITY eine gute Chance hat. (Sonst würde ich das hier auch nicht mehr tippen, sondern mir einen 'schönen' Abend machen.)
Wenn dann die legalen Kontrake geschlossen sind, ist IMA in der Verantwortung. Die 'Peer Group' wird in der Folge durch die Beitritte aller Mitglieder zu erweitern sein. Dafür braucht es eine Frist (30 Tage?). Eine Vollversammlung muss einberufen werden, das Board muss gewählt werden. Die Funktionen, die in den behördlich genehmigten Statuten festgelegt wurden, müssen eingerichtet und besetzt werden. Dafür braucht es Freiwillige, die Verantwortung übernehmen wollen. Also meldet euch! Denn Selbstverwaltung heißt ja auch Mitverantwortung.
Zu klären und abzustimmen wird noch sein, wie man die bestehenden club-Mitgliedschaften berücksichten könnte. Rechtlich kann Christophe Ruelle nämlich nichts machen, ohne in justiziable Schwierigkeiten zu geraten. Ähnlich ist es für uns innerhalb der IMA (also nicht nur der kleinen Peer-Group, sondern dann innerhalb der gesamten Mitgliederschaft.) Es ist ein vertracktes Problem, an dessen Lösung - bzw. an einem tragfähigen Vorschlag - wir arbeiten.
Und nun noch etwas, was mit dem ganzen Prozedere nur wenig zu tun hat. Mein persönlicher Wunsch wäre nämlich, dass wir den aktuellen Content aller aktiven Mitglieder ohne Verlust in das neue IPERNITY hinüberretten. (Auch darüber wird William Sutherland mit Christophe Ruelle sprechen.) Und dass wir gerade in diesen unsicheren Tagen nicht aufhören, IPERNITY lebendig und interessant zu halten. Getreu dem Motto: "Es ist nicht wichtig, ob ein Glas halb voll, oder halb leer ist. Wichtig ist nur, dass noch genügend volle Flaschen da sind!"
In dem Sinne würde ich mich darüber freuen, wenn alle Optimisten in den nächsten Tagen/Wochen vermehrt in ihren persönlichen Archiven kramen und - wie ich - täglich zwei bis drei Bilder hochladen, damit IPERNITY uns auch während dieser Hängepartie noch richtig Freude macht! Danach sowieso, wieder, und immer mehr!
Danke!
Bernhard Westrup
St. Johann in Tirol
(Bergfex)
(Weitere Rückfragen sind willkommen. Ich kann sie jedoch - im Hinblick auf meinen eigenen Terminkalender - nur Sonntagabend oder erst wieder am kommenden Mittwoch beantworten. Denn ich bin Montag/Dienstag in Köln/Troisdorf/Wermelskirchen zur Stiftungsratssitzung der Stiftung "Ein Herz lacht". Das ist mein persönliches soziales Engagement für jene Kinder, die sonst 'durch die Maschen fallen'. Und es ist mir - sorry - noch wichtiger als unser Luxusproblemchen hier! )
Wer sich kundig machen möchte, oder sogar etwas für Jene tun möchte, die (ganz real) innerhalb unserer heilen Welt nahe am Abgrund leben, die sich die Augen reiben würden über das, was uns hier umtreibt, schaut einfach rein:
www.einherzlacht.org
www.gutalteheide.de
Bergfex club(Thankyou very much!):
Thanks for that important informations Bergfex. I tried to make a translation into English, not knowing how propper it is. Of course I can talk about the weather and a bit about photographs, but such terms are not so common to myself. It is a cooperation of an online translater (NOT G**gle at all!!) and my brain. Hope we did our job well.
Some sentences, which I didn't found necessary for understanding, I didn't translate. I tried to mark them.
It took me three hours or a whole SUNNY Sunday morning to do this. But I happily did it, because I appreciate the work of IMA very much. I want to send my deepest thank to all of you and encourage you to carry on.
Best regards from sunny Vienna!
The text from Bergfex:
No, you havn't overlooked anything. But 'Team-Ipernity' only exists as the owner (Christophe Ruelle). From him does not come a lot anymore. Unfortunately.
Therefore, I want to try - as a Co-Founder within the IMA - to answer your question as definite as possible (On German! If Somebody can translate certifiedly into the English/Französische/Spanische or may: very much with pleasure! The Google translator provides because sometimes more for confusion than for clarity!).
Christophe agrees to hand over the platform to IMA. (This is known so far.) The crowdfunding initiated by William Sutherland has crossed the hurdle necessary for it (25,000$). (Also this is known.)
IMA is ready, however, waits still for important figures and document copies which Christophe has to put together. We need them to check dependably whether the continue of IPERNITY is generally realistic.
Sales-willing enterprises usually provide all information for such 'Due Diligence' to begin with. (In large companies, this can be offices full of files where potential byers can inform themselves.) Unfortunately, this is not the case here. We as IMA had to and still have to ask for everything quite laboriously, resp. request copies of receipts beint sent to us. Unfortunately, this lasts longer than we like. The bottleneck is the current owner, not IMA! On the other hand, Christophe is absolutely co-operative. You may recognise that, that he allows the platform to stay online, although dates must be pushed out over and over again. (In the end, this does cost his money, not that of the IMA.) At the moment all we as IMA can do is nothing but wait. And we also are not happy with this impasse. What keeps us going is our steadfast optimism and the firm wish to keep this special platform alive!
The next benchmark is a planned Skype conference between William Sutherland and Christophe Ruelle on Monday / Tuesday (03rd/04th of April). If Christophe delivers all requested data by documents, things may go on quite fast. Although we seven 'Founder' (alphabetically: Bernhard Westrup (Austria), Don Sutherland (USA), Eric Desjour (France), Lutz Petersen (Germany), Sami Serole (Finland), Sara Shriv (Great Britain) and William Sutherland (USA)) live around the whole globe within different time zones, our internal communication works quite quickly.
I have chosen the alphabetical order, by the way, because there is no rank order, or could not be one. Still no plenary assembly with elections has taken place! Possibly even quite different names can stand afterwards for those who (want to) take over responsibility. Presently we are only a Peer-Group! What will be afterwards, will be decided by the members of the plenary assembly - all those who join the IMA obligingly - i.e. not only by mouse click concerning IPERNITY group, but quite specifically with their yearly subscription.(I have no idea on that subject. Depending on the last sentence, I translate s.th. here, I do not know the sense of. No guarantee for it, sorry!! If there are any questions, please ask Bernhard/Bergfex ;-) Leon_Vienna)
We will suggest details, as soon as the matter with Christophe Ruelle is cut and dried. Before that, it would be a waste of resources, since some of us are still in their full working life! We do our thing in our spare time without remuneration! We have no staff, doing preparatory works for us. We also have no PR department which could maintain a FAQ and would be able to post daily topical news. (I have been working sometimes within a large corporation in such a department. I am completely aware of what you miss here! Therefore, we only can ask you for patience, understanding and forbearance! We do our best! For example, I am typing this just in the renunciation of a common evening with my wife - who luckily has big understanding for my engagement. And, too, it isn't the work of minutes. If a statement should be clear and crisp, one needs the more time for it.)
If 'Due Diligence' should prove that a continue of IPERNITY is economically senseless, the platform is switched off and the crowdfunding will be canceled. Gone, in that case. Unfortunately! Therefore, it makes sense, to protect our contents with HTTrack on own equipment - if they are important to us. (It works quite well if you set the correct options. You afterwards can see and further use at all contents offline and, even if the Ipernity servers (in the Amazon cloud) are switched off sometime.)
Nevertheless, if 'Due Diligence' proves, that IPERNITY has a realistic chance of continue, the technical and economic transmission from IPERNITY S.A. on IMA shall be carried out as the next step. This contains some legal formalities, and can't happen simply by "signature on a beer mat"(oijoijoijoi, everything clear? Leon_Vienna). But because both involved parties are interested in a quick and free from problems handing over, it might (hopefully) not take too much time.
We as a Peer-Group of the IMA, in any case consistently think - also in consideration of all data being already up to now - that IPERNITY has a good chance. (Otherwise, I would not be typing here anymore, but make a nice evening to myself.)
As soon legal contracts are done, IMA must take on responsibility. 'Peer Group' shall be extended subsequently by the entries of all members. Therefore it needs a term (30 days?). A plenary assembly must be called up, the board must be chosen. The functions which were fixed in the officially approved statutes must be set up and took on. For that it needs volunteers who want to take over responsibility. So announces yourself! Since self-government also means joint responsibility.
As well it need to be cleared and coordinated, how to consider existing club memberships. Because juridically Christophe Ruelle can't do anything without getting in justiciable difficulties. It is similar for us within the IMA (not only the small Peer-Group, but also within the whole member's group.) It is a tricky problem on whose solution - or a practicable (feasable) proposal - we work.
And now something that deals little with the whole process. My personal wish would be, that we can save the topical contents of all active members without loss into new IPERNITY (also that about William Sutherland will speak with Christophe Ruelle.) And that we do not stop, esepciality during these unsafe days, holding IPERNITY lifely and interesting. Faithful to the motto: "It is not important whether a glass is half-filled or it is half-empty. It is only important that there are still enough full bottles!"
In that sense I would be glad, if all optimists rummage during next days/weeks increasingly their personal archives and - like myself - post daily two to three pictures, so that IPERNITY can make us also during this slope part still joy! Afterwards anyway, again, and more and more!
(Further inquiries are welcome. I can answer them, nevertheless - in view of my own appointment calendar - only Sunday, 2. April on the evening or again from next Wednesday (5.April) on. Since I am Monday / Tuesday in Köln/Troisdorf/Wermelskirchen to the endowment council meeting of "A Heart Laughs". This is my personal social engagement for those children who otherwise "fall by the meshes". And it is even more important to me - sorry - than our little luxury problem here!)
Who wants to know more of it, or would like to do even something for those, who live in our propper world (quite really) near in the abyss, and who would rub themselves the eyes about what worries us here, looks simply at:
www.einherzlacht.org
www.gutalteheide.de
Thanks!
Bernhard Westrup
St.Johann in Tyrol
(Bergfex)
Enjoy it - and Ipernity of course! ;-)
Have a great week all together.
Hopefully we will have a further update on the Skype Conference today and tomorrow. (3rd/4th April) between William and Christopher.
Thank you Leon for the English translation much appreciated.
Leon_Vienna club has replied to Treasa Ui CionaodhaWould it be possible to get (at least) a weekly newsletter/update with the official IMA opinion about the situation of that moment (financial/timepath/figures and facts ....).
Marko Novosel club has replied to Jaap van 't Veen clubSami Serola (inactiv… club has replied to Jaap van 't Veen clubMeanwhile please rely on the information we have given on our latest news.